Torrance child care and odd pricing action: Torrance home sells for $27,000 and is immediately listed for $485,000.

The morning news is now covering how unaffordable Los Angeles housing has become.  Just this morning there was a story about rental prices increasing the prevalence of poverty in the area.  Apparently this is somehow going to resolve itself even though cracks are now starting to form in the economic landscape.  There is now a band of people that seem to have this odd idea that everything economic and politically oriented is about keeping prices up for their crap shack.  You can have a story about an “asteroid set to destroy Earth” but they would respond by saying “but even if the meteor causes prices to drop 10 percent, it will always go up later.”   By the way, a 10 or 20 percent down drop equates to $70,000 or $140,000 for a typical Taco Tuesday crap shack.  Today I’m going to ask readers to dig into this story a bit more because I’m not exactly sure what is going on with this Torrance property.

Moving a property fast in Torrance

Torrance is one of those crap shack filled hoods.  Dull looking homes built before many baby boomers were even in diapers, this area has seen some dramatic price appreciation.  We did an in-depth analysis of an entire city block here and it would appear that most people on that block wouldn’t even have a remote opportunity of buying their own property back today even if they wanted to.  Many used this as justification for the buy now or be priced out forever meme.

I found something odd with this property but readers might have more insight into the background here:

torrance home

16920 Elgar Ave,

Torrance, CA 90504

2 beds, 1 bath 770 square feet

The ad is simple and to the point:

“Great starter home to get you into this wonderful neighborhood, add to make bigger or enjoy the large back yard.”

Well at least we have one sentence to work off of. There is nothing odd about this listing.  This is your typical crap shack in a gentrifying hood.  What is odd is the pricing action here:

price history

This place sold for $160,000 back in 1997.  It has a closing sale on 8/10/2015 for $27,000 and is immediately listed back on the market for $485,000.  On Redfin the property is listed as “accepting back up offers” so it does already have some traction.  Why is there a $27,000 recorded sale?

So I went on Google and found that this address was linked to a child day care:

torrance property

http://listings.findthecompany.com/l/19673292/Day-Treehouse-Care-in-Torrance-CA

The address listed is for this property.  I’m assuming this child care is no longer in operation unless there is a new method of showing homes with kids already in the property.  According to the link above, this child care was making good money since 2010 (at least if the link above has any validity).

Regardless of the outcome, do any sleuths in the Torrance area have any deeper insight?  There might be a simple explanation to the $27,000 sales price.

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58 Responses to “Torrance child care and odd pricing action: Torrance home sells for $27,000 and is immediately listed for $485,000.”

  • It isn’t uncommon for well to do parents to sell their kids their old house at a song. Then kid finishes school or whatever and sells the house for cash. You need to look at the deeds.

    • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

      Parents don’t need to “Sell” to their kids, all they need to do is GIFT the property to their KIDS .. there is no “Step-up” in value when the transfer is done between Parent and Child and there is NO Capital Gains tax either They can add the Children to the Title or “quit claim” the property to the Child or Children. The problem arises when Parents don’t either “add” their kids to the title before they Die .. or worse yet they put the property in the will and will it to their kids .. This would trigger a Probate Court Hearing, because there is NO way to move that Title to the children once the Parent is dead.

      If they sold the property for far less than Market value, it could be between relatives (not parent-child), or it could be a method to reduce the Capital Gain … or part of another complicated transaction involving other property or types of property– which is also allowed, and is perfectly legal.

      • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

        Just one caveat — that the Parent has not exceeded the “life time Gift limitation”
        ===============================
        http://www.forbes.com/sites/ashleaebeling/2014/10/30/irs-announces-2015-estate-and-gift-tax-limits/
        ===============================
        IRS Announces 2015 Estate And Gift Tax Limits
        ===============================
        The Internal Revenue Service announced the 2015 estate and gift tax limits today, and the federal estate tax exemption rises to $5.43 million per person, and the annual gift exclusion amount stays at $14,000. These numbers, adjusted annually for inflation, matter to wealthy folks who are trying to whittle down their estates by making gifts to family members. It’s an annual exercise, done at year-end or the first of the year, depending on the family. Here are the numbers to talk about this holiday season.

        The federal estate tax exemption—that’s the amount an individual can leave to heirs without having to pay federal estate tax—will be $5.43 million in 2015, up from $5.34 million for 2014. That’s another $90,000 that can be passed on tax-free.

      • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

        … Could be just a coincidence ??– $14,000 times two = $27,000
        The annual gift exclusion amount is $14,000
        ======================================
        >>> Price history – 08/10/15 – SOLD – $27,000

      • “The problem arises when Parents don’t either “add” their kids to the title before they Die .. or worse yet they put the property in the will and will it to their kids .. This would trigger a Probate Court Hearing, because there is NO way to move that Title to the children once the Parent is dead.”

        Please explain this. My sister and I will inherit my mom’s house. We will also inherit prop 13. Are you saying that we should be on the deed right now? I’ve never heard this before. Why is there a problem inheriting a house that’s written in the will?

      • Never mind, I just remembered we have a ‘living will’ that allows us to skip that part. Whew!!

      • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

        @Jeff: Your question:-
        “Please explain this. My sister and I will inherit my mom’s house. We will also inherit prop 13. Are you saying that we should be on the deed right now? I’ve never heard this before. Why is there a problem inheriting a house that’s written in the will?”
        =========================================
        You should spend a few dollars and speak to a property attorney.
        However — If you know you will be inheriting your Parent’s property, and they are elderly – then there is nothing wrong with adding your name to the Property Title and it is perfectly legal. Alot of families do that. Whether your parents “Gift” the home to you NOW or you inherit it after their “passing” .. the property title will end up in your name. WILLS still have to be “probated” .. or how else will the prop.title get transfered when the parents aren’t there to sign the quit claim deed; by the order of a state court or probate court …. that’s how it would transfer title.
        ==========================================
        ** AGAIN– You should spend a few dollars and speak to a property attorney.

      • Actually, what you really want to do is inherit real estate to get the step up in your tax basis. This is how the rich avoid paying any taxes at all. If you bought a house for $100,000 20 years ago and it is worth $500,000 now, if you gift it, the beneficiary gets the grantor’s basis, which is $100,000. If you sold the house the very next day, you would pay capital gains on $400,000. If you inherit the real estate, the basis is stepped up to FMV, which would be $500,000. You could sell the house the very next day after dad dies and pay zero taxes. As for probate, typically a non-issue for most people. If you do some estate planning you can avoid it altogether, most people who are prepared don’t go through probate, if you did, it just means you didn’t plan ahead. Probate has nothing to do with the taxation, it’s just an outdated process of disposing of the assets of someone who died. If you have a good estate plan in place, you can avoid probate and put your beneficiaries in a great tax position. The dumbest thing a lot of people do is change the title of their real property or gift it to their children while they are alive. Certainly there may be reasons for doing that, but for most people the best way to go is to bequeath real property especially if there is a lot of built in gain.

  • EPA toxic waste site. ( It’s the pampers. )

  • Most likely a 4 year delinquent home that was bought in auction and then but on the market place

    Good Luck in getting $485,000 for that in Torrance

    My next door neighbor had that situation in Irvine

    But they sold in Auction at $492,000 that buyer tried to sell for $563,000 then finally sold I believe for $532,000

    On another note, I do expect the Fed to Hike Rates in September, I know I know, even with the recent market drama, they have met their metrics to get off of ZIRP

    So they’re bent on hiking rates

    http://loganmohtashami.com/2015/08/16/fed-and-the-first-rate-hike/

    • Put down the pipe bro. There’s now way in hell they’re hiking rates, in fact QE4 is right around the corner.

      • @we’re gonna be rich!–you’re probably right, but I hope you’re wrong. People with power and money are getting rich. hiking rates, slowing down easy money would end the party.

    • Logan, you are correct they won’t get 485K. And there is only one reason for that. It’s a 2/1 770 sq ft. If this were a 3/1 or 3/2 greater than 1000 sq ft, they would easily get 485K. Even the worst parts of Torrrance (Harbor Gateway, LAUSD school district) is surprising expensive. You won’t touch a crap box for under 600K in any decent part of Torrance and that is a fact.

      #desirable!

      • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

        How large is the LOT SIZE .. how many Square feet ?? Because if the lot is more the , let’s say 6,500 Sq.ft. – It is possible to put a 3,000 sq.ft house on that lot – either single story or two-story house. Actually depending on the city, you can go as large as 3,500 sq.ft – it depends on the “set-backs” and easements.
        It is CHEAPER to build a home than to buy an “existing clean house” with all the nice granite finishes,etc,etc — That’s assuming you have some knowledge of how to hire Contractors and manage the City Permitting process, and know where to buy building materials competitively.

    • Torrance is more expensive than Irvine. That home is a relative deal at 485k.

  • According to title the $27K was a partial sale, kinda like a second

    • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

      Just curious, did the title transfer show the same last name, between family members?

      Here in the San Gabriel Valley, actual sales are “stagnating” because Owners are consistently passing their homes which they’ve owned for 20 plus years to their Children or family members — normally as Gifts or “related party transfers”.

  • It’s not uncommon in my NY location to see these “odd” transactions listed in the County property pages. The property appears to change hands several times over a relatively short time between seemingly unrelated entities but in fact they are one in the same, albeit with a different name and organizational set up, i.e. from a trust to a llc to a private etc.. It is more prevalent in ‘depressed’ locations. It’s a tax related thing.

  • Not too hard to sleuth this one. Simplest thing would be to ask the listing agent, who is also the buyer at $27,000. Or look up the deed. The deed says it is a partial value transfer based on the “full value less liens and encumbrances remaining at the time of sale.” My guess is he took over the liens and encumbrances and paid the seller $27,000 for their equity.

  • Hey Doc,

    I looked up the $27,000 deed. It was tagged “P” for partial value transfer.

    It’s not a “Full Value” transfer. Meaning they bought the property by paying $27,000 in cash and they took title subject to the existing liens.

    Existing liens appear to be:

    Recording Date: 08/17/2006 Document#: 06-1831443
    Loan Amount: $375,000.00 Loan Type: J
    TD Due Date: 09/01/2036 Type of Financing: ADJ
    Lender Name: SCME MORTGAGE BANKERS INC

    Thanks for your articles Doc.

    • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

      Yeah — but the Title documents you are looking at .. does NOT tell us what the “remaining loan balance” might be on that Mortgage …. So there is something else going on with the supposed sale of the property.

      • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

        The mortgage may have a very small balance remaining …

      • @Paul (not a Realtor), sorry Paul but if the remaining loan balance were low then there would be no trust deed sale. Odds are there is little to no equity, hence the partial value transfer.

      • Paul - ( not a Realtor )

        To ” ernst blofeld ” : I think there’s a misunderstanding here ( maybe mine).
        ===============
        Once a Lein is recorded for a Mortgage, the Title Records at the County Office will show the “Full Original Amount of the Lien”, whether or not the encumbrance was paid down …let’s say paid all the way to $100.00 remaining on the Loan. The Title Records will only show the original Loan of $375,000 (in this case).

        You’re using the term “trust deed sale” … do you think it is a foreclosure type of sale,
        because this is not a foreclosure sale . It would show judicial or non-judicial.
        Fyi – I notice the websites like Zillow, Redfin,etc. will show a “Defaulted Mortgage” or “Notice of Default”, and the information is fairly accurate
        I don’t think the Title Records for this property show this as a Foreclosure .
        …. from what was described below:
        =======================================
        Recording Date: 08/17/2006 Document#: 06-1831443
        Loan Amount: $375,000.00 Loan Type: J
        TD Due Date: 09/01/2036 Type of Financing: ADJ
        Lender Name: SCME MORTGAGE BANKERS INC
        ======================================

  • Or possibly an older person that needs long term care has liquidated their assets for nothing to their family to qualify for State of CA long term care???? It happens.

  • The antiquated TV antenna has got to be worth 4.5 thou.. how about 2.5 for the hose and storage unit…turn off the damn porch light.. you gotta save for the humongous monthly mortgage payment.

  • Carlos from Oxnard, the Newport Beach

    May be the child care business went into bankruptcy and some vulture got a good deal on the bidding. I have never done this because it would be wrong. As a Realtor I am ethic(not ethnic) bound not to take advantage of other people. I got a 70 on my ethics part of the test(after I retook it). I haven’t been doing much better with the Coast Guard and the Captain Morgan, but that is another story.

  • My guess is the real estate agent is a crook.

  • A prime example of why we will NOT be coming back to Southern California in retirement, except to vacation, perhaps. We have a beautiful four bedroom, two bathrooms plus powder room, den, 2600 square foot home with an 11,000 square foot lot that we could get $325,000 for on today’s market. California is a mess. Nice climate, though.
    I wonder what is going to happen when Silicon Valley tech companies figure out that they can move somewhere else and lower their cost of doing business by millions.

    • Bob, they have figured out that the talent isn’t there when they relocate to other cities… And that talent doesn’t want to move from Palo Alto to Reno or Kansas City…

      • WeDontMakeThoseDrinksNoMore

        Yes Jeff, I’ve heard stories about the glamorous and sophisticated lives some tech workers lead in NorCal; living in shipping containers, backyard tents, illegal housing, couch surfing, crowded apartments or having to commute hours on crowded freeways to get to work. Might be really tough to give up such a lifestyle, LOL.

      • son of a landlord

        WeDontMakeThoseDrinksNoMore, you’re being sarcastic, but you’re inadvertently correct.

        I know people who live in Manhattan (in New York City, not Manhattan Beach). One lives in a $350,000 co-op — a studio apt. One tiny room, a tiny kitchenette, a small bathroom. His brother earns $250,000 a year and lives in a 2-bedroom co-op in the East 80s.

        Neither can imagine living anywhere outside of Manhattan. Even returning to the outer boroughs would be death (they grew up in Queens and Nassau). Moving to Manhattan, living in the Big Apple, means they’ve Made It! Moving to Flyover Country would be Unthinkable.

        I know people in L.A. who feel the same way. Better a tiny box in the Center of the Universe than a mansion in Flyover Country.

        I’m sure there are people in San Fran who feel that way about their city.

        So when you say, “Might be really tough to give up such a lifestyle, LOL.“, you’re joking. But such people fail to see the humor. It really would be tough for them to give up their tiny abodes for a mansion in Flyover County.

      • I am married to “the talent” (CS degree from a top 10 engineering school and PhD from great tech school) and we LEFT Silicon Valley after a year. It was too expensive there, plus the people/culture were the other issues.

      • Austin, Portland, Denver.

      • Jeff… Good take, even though CA. Has it woes, the talent pool is huge and the pluses out weigh the minus of let’s say relocate to Reno or Salt Lake City. Many years ago Lockheed put faclties in Denver many CA folks transfer, many didn’t like Denver and either went back to CA or moved to Arz. Lockheed ran into a labor pool problem as Denver isn’t big enough to fill the skilled void, I can remember that a Silicon Valley company took heed of that problem and such stay in CA for just that reason.

  • Off topic: what typically happens to the house in a reverse mortgage when the original owner passes? Does the property become lender-owned? Do these lenders hold onto the property much like a foreclosure and resell at auction?

    • Willie… If no heirs are left or they don’t wish to sell the property, the lender puts the house for sale just like a resale. It isn’t listed as a foreclsure because reverse mortages are a no recourse loan. A person who defaults on a Reverse Mortage because they didn’t pay taxes or insurance is handle the same way, the home is resold as a special loan default just like a person who didn’t leave the house to someone.

  • Essentially Fannie Mae is going to try to get home challenged people (people who probably should never buy a home because of their financial knowledge) into home again. The previous attempt was called subprime loans.

    ———————————————-

    Buying a Home Just Got Easier for Cash-Strapped Families

    http://time.com/money/4013145/fannie-mae-homeready-mortgage-low-income-households/?xid=yahoo_money

    Government-sponsored mortgage giant Fannie Mae is starting a new home loan program for low-income borrowers called HomeReady, with the goal of improving creditworthy consumers’ access to affordable mortgages through low down-payment requirements, homeownership education and other specialized underwriting criteria.

    Additionally, applicantions can include incomes from borrowers who will not be living in the homes, such as parents, as well as rental income the borrower may generate from something like renting out a basement apartment. HomeReady can help any qualified borrowers, whether they’re first-time homebuyers or not, to purchase a home with a down payment as low as 3% of the property value.

    The program is supposed to extend homeownership access to low-income consumers

  • The solution as to why we see a $27,000 figure has more than one possible answer. That is what makes real estate intriguing to me. The replies so far indicate I am amongst my peers, my comrades, my competitors.

    The bigger picture is that we have too much time right now so we editorialize our market as armchair quarterbacks.vs participation in buying of assets.

    And why is this? Because the savvy and experienced owner investor knows we are in the fat part of “Bubbletown” now. We all are sitting and reading and waiting. My question today is where can an investor go in the United States for a normal flip or hold that will provide a decent return? Thank you all

  • It looks like it could have been an assumable mortgage.

  • My wife wanted to buy this property because her mom lives in Shadow Hills and we could always rent it when we found a home in Sherman Oaks.

    https://www.redfin.com/CA/Sun-Valley/10149-Wealtha-Ave-91352/home/5462875/crisnet-SR14247830 at $315,000

    Boy am I glad I kept telling her it was overpriced then and way overpriced now.
    https://www.redfin.com/CA/Sun-Valley/10149-Wealtha-Ave-91352/home/5462875 price cut at $475,000.

    Maybe this flipper will stop flipping going forward.

    She didn’t buy in Sherman Oaks in 2012 and could have resold for double today (oh well), but I think we will wait out till the next downturn which is already happening.

  • Austin,Portland,Denve???? Live in these towns for six months, know what, you find out same concerns exsist on a smaller scale.

    Don’t think a “Leave it to Beaver Life” is outside of CA or anyplace else, America in general has big problems. Take care

    • For most of the rest of the country those problems don’t include a lack of water supply.

      • FRED….The main worry for Ca. And it is huge massive damage from a 8.0. Water (?) they have had droughts for ever. We lived there in the 7 year drought where houses were about 90k avg, today same house $1.5 million.

        No place without concerns, but a earthQuake yes is a reason to leave if you can afford it.That was the main reason we left, the Northridge quake did us in.

    • I’ve been in Portland for 10 months, and I’m kicking myself that I didn’t move here sooner. It’s a night and day difference. There are zillions of walkable, safe neighborhoods in town with good schools, it’s clean, the parks are incredible, and there’s a ton of beautiful nature activities just outside of town. I’m already dreading the visit to LA over the holidays. I wouldn’t move back to LA, even if it was less expensive than Portland.

      • son of a landlord

        Sounds like you found a nice area of Portland. The northwest district?

        But I hear Portland also has plenty of homeless, methheads and other junkies, and strip clubs. And the southeast area is supposed to be especially ghetto.

        Then there’s talk of the Pacific Northwest being long overdue for MEGAquake — over 9.0, whereas California’s Big One will likely max out at 7.8.

      • I felt the same way when I 1st moved there. Come back and post after your 5th dreary, never ending, constantly raining winter with overly medicated people. Ever wonder why everyone is so vacant and nice? Portland is the most medicated city in America and has the highest suicide rate. Do try to be aware of your emotional state and that of your family too. I’m not kidding. Depression is slips into a person with out a lot of bells and whistles. I am glad to be back in LA — smaller house, LA troubles and all. Different mind set here. I had troubles making friends because most of the men up there are hipsters or men who were part of the lumber and shipping industries and inculcated to someone giving them a job. People come to LA because places like Portland are too small for them. Small words. Small ideas. And peer pressure to stay small. I kept hearing from people up there that I wasn’t “Portland enough” or that I wasn’t a “Portlander” because I didn’t fit into the archetype. “The Peoples Republic of Portland”, right? You see the bumper stickers all over. Or “Capitalism — the predatory phase of mans evolution.” Oh it was a bitch being a small business person up there with propaganda like that flying around up there.

      • All of my LA friends who visit us here in Portland are astounded about how clean, safe and beautiful the neighborhoods in-town are here. It’s like a zillion college towns pushed up together. There really isn’t anything like it, and all four quadrants of the city have great areas. You have to go way out east (or far North) for things to start getting sketchy, and I’m not sure we’ve ever even been east of 82nd, so we just aren’t aware of those areas. Go way out west, and it’s the opposite in that’s really nice, suburban areas (like Beaverton.) The approximately 10 square miles in the center of Portland (with the river running down the middle) is mostly great.

        We live in the Grant Park/Rose City Park area of town. The homeless are mostly concentrated downtown in the Northwest, so we don’t deal with it much. I lived in Hollywood for over a decade, so I laugh at the supposed homeless, traffic, housing cost, etc, issues here. Can’t think of a place I’ve seen in the US that I’d pick over this, for just about any price.

        I did love the “Big One” article in the New Yorker. I hope it keeps people away. 😉

      • Tolucatom, you’re probably right in that it depends on the person. I’m a 30-something musician that is fortunate to own a business in TV production, so I may have a different perspective. I walk to coffee shops, go to art galleries, go to dinners and bars on occasion (we actually found a babysitter who lives next door!,) and our 3 year old is in an amazing pre-school a few blocks away (public k-12 schools in our neighborhood are great, too.) Plus, we rent a turnkey home that’s 2400 sq ft. in a neighborhood I’d probably compare to West Hollywood or Silverlake, and the owners only paid $500K for it last year (we’re waiting to see what the market does in the next year or two before buying, because Portland is bubbly, too.) This house would likely be close to 1.5-2 million bucks in West Hollywood.

        Point being, we all like different things, so I’m not surprised everyone doesn’t love it here in Portland, but we sure do. I have close friends that have lived here for years, after coming from LA, and they still don’t regret it. Due to my business, we can quite literally live anywhere in the US, and this was our choice. I don’t think we’ll regret it.

  • Went to an open house down the street here in Fremont, SF East Bay.
    A 1979 3 & 2 for 750 K. no cars or lookers, so I asked the agent how things were lately with the “offshore” buyers.
    He said that has slowed down some since june. He mentioned that the Chinese cash buyers were mostly using borrowed money from the Chinese banks at 1% interest.
    It will be interesting to see if the Chi-Com govt. reacts to all the money leaving the country.

  • Why your rich Chinese neighbor will go broke quicker than you think (quoted from Quora), thought this was very appropriate for this site and all you bears out there:

    Let me bring it all together with a real world example and show how China and other EM can affect the US market. It has nothing to do with international trade and exports, but with built in self reinforcing loops in the system.

    Chinese, Russians, Brazilians, Indians (and other EM wealthy citizens) who have been buying New York and Miami real estate as if they are hot cakes, now see the value of their in-country portfolio (liquid) diminish and the value of their US real estate (iliquid) rise. They have lots of money offshore (out of their home countries) sitting a JPMorgan, Credit Suisse, UBS, Goldman Sachs, etc. Those accounts usually have an overweight US focus. That means that the Chinese billionaire didn’t take his money out of China to buy Chinese and Indian stocks, they buy Apple, ExxonMobil, Disney, Google, etc. Park that for a moment.

    If you speak to real estate agents in NY or Miami they will tell that their international buyer has paid cash for their $10m condo and there is no reason to worry. They are not like the Americans who need a mortgage, they show up with $10m cash. Park that also in your mind

    When you speak to a private banker who oversees the money for these wealthy Chinese/Russian/etc. they will tell you that his/her client got a loan against his/her portfolio to pay for his condo cash. That condo is really not paid for. The client gave JPMorgan some $12m in stocks and got $10m in cash, which was wired to buy property (or a Picasso painting). That can create a huge problem for their personal balance sheet (plus developers and real estate agents in NY and Miami).

    Putting all parked pieces into into motion. As EM slows down the EM wealthy guy makes less and less money from his business, he may even have to put more cash to keep the business afloat (I personally know people doing this already).

    1) The flow of money from his home country to his JPMorgan account that used to be $1m per month with the slow down and currency depreciation evaporates.
    2) He needs that money to pay the loan to JPMorgan that he used the proceeds to buy the $10m condo.
    3) He can’t service that debt with money coming from his home country because of #1 so he needs to sell some stock.
    4) If he has $15m in the account he can sell a maximum of $3m because JPM requires 120% coverage on the loan.He can wire $30m from UBS, but that is tied to another loan he got to buy a Picasso painting. Given the $1m he was sending from his home country is no longer available he has 3 months of burn before JPM liquidates his portfolio to repay the loan.
    5) He call his broker and ask to put the condo for sell
    6) The Fed raises rate so JPM adjusts the cost of debt on the loan collaterized by the stocks and now the client only has 40 days burn
    7) Real estate borker says market is soft and it will likely take 6 months to sell. Suggests that he spends money on advertising and staging the condo. He call his art dealer and puts the Picasso for sale. In parallel his trying to get any of his Chinese friends to buy his multiple cases of Chateau Lafite.
    8) US market down another 5% and JPM makes a margin call. Client cannot wire more money and JPM takes over the portfolio and sell in the market quickly to recoup the $10m.
    9) This happens thousands of times as private bank clients cannot meet their obligations and the banks dump stock in the market, S&P500 goes down creating a self fulfilling prophecy.

    This is just an example, BUT THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE IN THAT SITUATION THAN YOU THINK. Rich people also make stupid financial decisions, mismanage their liquidity and go broke. There are many more instances but as long as you have liquidity problems markets will overshoot beyond the rational point. The only comfort is that a more developed market as the US will over shoot much less than EM. China is most worrisome because it is much large than the others

  • Jumbo that is a nice war and piece post. We have had post on the site about the spending habits of the 1% to 2% and especially the Chinese. They are free spenders and leverage very heavy against portfolio. They can and will pull back in a NY minute, thus you are right for the leverage Bay area-Miami-NYC to be worried,matter of fact I have stated many times the Manhattan RE market is primed for bust

    NYC is again out of control, with the mayor having no clue on running a big town. SF will be a very tough town to get your money back once it’s pancake back to a 10 year setback in RE market. Miami will fair only slightly better since they have a more diverse buyer not specific like NYC and SF, but will feel the pain.

    Yes I know many Chinese people, very nice and like a good American time, they also have a fetish to spend big a.” look at me” mentality and it will haunt the RE market if it all goes South and I don’t mean Texas?

    PS Texas and Colorado, it is coming soon to your neighborhood especially Houston and Denver suburbs, the ” I can’t go wrong over paying for a house” will be, can I sell this barn anytime soon?

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